In today’s episode, I am joined by the incredible Susie Hamilton as she shares her spine-tingling story of transformation from someone who wrestled with tokophobia, the fear of pregnancy and birth, to becoming a surrogate.
When Susie discovered this podcast when she was preparing for pregnancy, she went on to use my fear clearance method to clear her fears of pregnancy and birth. This led to an incredible transformation in her. Not only did she have two wonderful births of her own children, but she has since embarked on the surrogacy journey, and she is currently pregnant with her second surrogate baby.
Susie’s story exemplifies the activation of inner power, self-advocacy, and the incredible impact that facing fears can have not only during childbirth but also in other aspects of life. As we delve into her experiences, we will explore the importance of feeling comfortable, making informed decisions, advocating for oneself, and embracing the journey with all its emotions.
Overcoming Fear: Susie’s Transformation from Anxiety to Empowerment
Pregnancy and childbirth can be daunting experiences, filled with fears and anxieties. But what if there was a way to transform that fear into empowerment? In this episode of the Fear Free Childbirth Podcast, Susie’s story is a testament to the power of overcoming fear and finding strength in vulnerability. Let us dive into Susie’s journey and explore the lessons we can learn from her transformation.
Embracing the Fear:
Susie’s journey starts with her admission of being terrified of pregnancy and childbirth. Like many expectant mothers, she found solace in the Fear Free Childbirth Podcast. Through the fear clearance method that I openly share, Susie learned to confront and release her fears, allowing her to embark on a path of radical transformation.
Activating Inner Power:
Susie’s story highlights the activation of inner power and self-advocacy in the birth context. She shares her belief in fully experiencing the moment, embracing all emotions and adrenaline that come with it. While some may prefer to be fully clothed during birth, Susie felt comfortable being naked, emphasising the importance of feeling safe and secure during such a vulnerable time.
The Journey into Surrogacy:
Susie’s positive birth experiences inspired her to explore surrogacy, so that she could to capture the empowering feeling of pregnancy without bringing another baby home. Despite her initial uncertainties, Susie embraced the opportunity when she met the qualifications and embarked on her incredible journey as a surrogate parent.
Self-Advocacy and Empowerment During Birth:
One message that’s clear throughout this episode is the importance of advocating for yourself during labour and delivery. From questioning the necessity of certain medical procedures to choosing different positions for labour. Susie shares how she fearlessly asserted her right to make decisions about her own body and the birth. Her experiences are a useful reminder that assertiveness and comfort are essential for a positive birth experience.
Building a Supportive Community:
Susie’s transformation was not just personal; she also found strength and support through the Fear Free Childbirth community and by starting her own Instagram account. By connecting with others who shared similar fears, Susie was able to overcome feelings of guilt and ungratefulness for desiring a peaceful pregnancy and birth. The power of community and the ability to create lifelong connections through shared experiences can really help you on this journey to motherhood, no matter what that looks like for you.
Susie’s tear-jerking story from fear to empowerment is a remarkable testament to the transformative power of embracing vulnerability and confronting your deepest fears.
Resources mentioned during the episode
During the episode, several resources were mentioned that helped the guest, Susie, overcome her fears and have a positive pregnancy and birth experience. These resources include:
1. Fear Free Childbirth Podcast: Susie found comfort and calmness by listening to the podcast during her second pregnancy and labor.
2. Online Research: Susie mentioned that she sought help by listening to podcasts and researching online resources to address her fears about pregnancy and childbirth.
3. Instagram Community: Susie started an Instagram account as an outlet to connect with others who shared her fears. Through this community, she met lifelong friends who changed her view of pregnancy.
4. Chiropractic Care and Massage Therapy: To help with muscle tension, Susie sought physical release through chiropractic care and massage therapy.
5. Worldwide Surrogacy Specialists: Susie used in the US to match with intended parents during this current surrogacy journey. They work with intended parents all over the world! Click here to follow them on Instagram.
These resources played a significant role in Susie’s journey of overcoming her fears and having a more positive pregnancy and birth experience.
Episode Timestamps
00:00:01 Fearless transformation from fearful to fearless.
00:03:53 Marriage, miscarriages, fear, support, empowerment, motherhood.
00:12:10 Peaceful, empowering birth experiences lead to surrogacy.
00:22:25 Becoming a surrogate: empowering, research, qualifications, anxiety
00:25:27 Anxiety during pregnancy, finding coping mechanisms.
00:32:58 Music helped during labor; instrumental was best.
00:37:54 Surrogate birth experience: empowering, healing, last one.
00:39:27 Grateful for birth experiences; overcoming fears.
00:43:56 Husband adjusts to wife’s need for space.
00:49:51 Advocate for yourself and be comfortable giving birth.
00:53:08 Children’s empathy and independence challenge parental authority.
00:57:27 Sharing anxieties, finding safe release, feeling supported.
Episode Guest
Meet Susie Hamilton, a remarkable individual who once feared pregnancy and childbirth but is now a mother of two and a two-time gestational surrogate. After facing pregnancy loss, she experienced anxiety surrounding pregnancy and birth, but her journey towards positive birthing experiences was challenging yet rewarding. She finds joy in sharing her newfound empowerment by assisting others in growing their families.
You can connect with her on Instagram:
@thebiggestask: An informative Instagram account dedicated to all things surrogacy-related
Episode Transcript
Alexia [00:00:01]:
Hello and welcome back to the Fear Free Childbirth Podcast. My name is Alexa Leachman. Thank you so much for joining me today. Now, as you know, this show is all about removing the fear out of birth, and I’ve got a story to share with you today that is just going to blow your mind. Today I’m going to be joined by Susie Hamilton. And Susie was terrified of pregnancy and birth, and she discovered the podcast a long, long time ago when I first brought it out and dived into everything that I was sharing and used my book and the fear clearance method that I share to help her to get rid of her fears. And she was able to do that so well that not only did she go on to have two babies of her own, but now she is a surrogate and is on her second surrogate baby. I know, right? Like totally bonkers turnaround. When she first let me know that this was the transformation that she had gone through, I was just mind blown, just totally mind blown. I knew I needed to speak to her and find out more about it. And that’s what I want to share with you today. And it’s really just as an aside, when you think about approaching pregnancy and birth, and if you are full of fear or full of anxiety, then this really is an opportunity for you to face up to some fears and anxieties that potentially are holding you back in other areas of your life, too. And that if you jump in with your feet first, who knows what kind of transformation you could bring about into your life. It’s not just about the pregnancy and the birth. One thing that you’ll hear in listening to Susie’s story is how much she was able to activate her inner sense of power and her ability to advocate for herself and stand up for herself. And this is something I think that a lot of women struggle with, particularly in the context of the birth environment. So I’m just going to hand over to this conversation with Susie because it is truly inspirational to hear such a transformation from fearful to fearless and incredible.
Alexia [00:02:36]:
Now, the other thing is, before I hand over, is you might notice that both of us sound a little bit emotional when we’re talking, because we were. I mean, I was just kind of bowled over by her story, and it was very emotional for her sharing it again, because I don’t think Susie Head shared it in quite the way that we had shared it during our conversation. So it really is just a heartwarming and emotional conversation. So maybe get some tissues ready. OK, I’ll hand it over. Susie, thank you so much for coming on the podcast. I cannot wait to have this conversation with you. So welcome.
Susie [00:03:08]:
Thank you for having me. I’m very excited.
Alexia [00:03:11]:
We’re going to talk about your journey from fearful to surrogate, which is quite a journey, and I can’t wait to head all about it, but let’s just rewind and start at the beginning. And also I’d just like to know a little bit about you and who you are, so just tell us a little bit about who you are.
Susie [00:03:27]:
So I am a 28 year old mom of two and I’ve had one additional pregnancy after that where I was a surrogate, and I gave birth last year to a surrogate baby for a couple that lives in Belgium and I live in the United States. And I’m actually currently pregnant with my second surrogate baby. I’m ten weeks today.
Alexia [00:03:50]:
Okay, so let’s go back to the beginning of this journey.
Susie [00:03:53]:
I got married very young and I didn’t start out scared of pregnancy or childbirth, but we went through two miscarriages prior to my first child, so he is six now. I wasn’t really scared until the first miscarriage was kind of accidental about a year into our marriage. I mean, obviously we were sad, but we were like, okay, it just wasn’t the right time. And then my husband deployed and he came home and at this point we had been married for about two years and we were like, okay, we’re going to try to have a baby. This is going to be the most exciting thing we’ve ever done. I got my first positive pregnancy test and I was not excited. I was so scared. I was like, oh, my gosh, I could just lose this one too. Obviously my body hasn’t proven me worthy. All the other things that could come along with self doubt and panic and I ended up losing that pregnancy too, pretty quickly. We never made it to an ultrasound, so I felt guilty for being sad, but I was so afraid to start trying again. And my husband encouraged me. He was like, let’s not give up. We’re young at this point. We were 20. We’re young, we have time, there’s nothing to panic about. And we tried again. And the very next month after that miscarriage, I had another positive pregnancy test and I was like, I don’t know if I can do this. It just all felt like such a big weight. And I had the most outrageous anxiety his entire pregnancy and it really took away from what I felt like would have been a very joyful time. And so I had to start looking for help because I’m like, what if I don’t? In my head, I couldn’t even picture giving birth when they say, picture your future, holding your baby. You’ll be so happy. And I didn’t have any of those feelings. I was not joyful. I was terrified. Searched out some online information because this was 2016. And what do you do in 2016? It’s the year of looking everything up on the Internet, and I found you. So I started listening to your podcasts, and I pretty much listened to them religiously, even the ones that didn’t really pertain to me. I still was like, I just need to listen because other people are experiencing other forms of worry or fear engulfed with pregnancy alone. And then at that point, I wasn’t even thinking about birth, and I was unprepared, which is odd because my sister is huge into advocating for birth. That goes your way. So she was a Willha League leader, and so I had so much support in terms of after birth, and she kept advocating for me to make the right birth choices, and I ended up getting diagnosed with polyhydramnios in my son’s pregnancy. So I had really high fluid levels. And so as a first time mom, I was 20 years old or 21 at the time. So I turned 21 when I was pregnant. At 21, I’m a first time mom. I’m terrified just of being pregnant in and of itself. And now they’re like, you need to be induced. So of course, I had to get over that fear because I had only ever heard of inductions going wrong. And to be quite frank, mine did not go perfectly, but I ended up with the birth that I had hoped for after using some of your head trash clearance and just trying to remind myself that as much as I was in control, I could not predict what was going to happen. So I had to kind of put myself in a headspace of, what can I control about this? And I was thankful that I was able to end up with a vaginal birth. I was induced. It took three days. I was induced on Wednesday, and he was born on Friday. At the end of the day, I got what I had hoped for, which was a vaginal birth. I ended up getting the epidural, which I was. And when I say, like, deathly afraid, I didn’t want to have them put something in my spine. I didn’t want to not feel in tune with my body. But I had the epidural because I was so tired. I got to day three, and this was like, midnight Friday morning, and I’m like, I can’t do this anymore. They had me on Pitocin. Of course. They had me on that to increase my contractions. And I had to listen to your podcast, and I listened to a little bit of, like, hypnobirthing as well while I was doing that because I’m like, I don’t want this epidural. I’m so scared. I looked over at the nurse, and I was like, just put me to sleep and cut him out. Like, I can’t do this. She looked at me and she’s like, you are going to push this baby out. I kind of toughened up. I was like, I’m going to get the epidural because it will help ease the physical pain that I’m in to help me clear this mental roadblock that I’m experiencing. So, of course, I had this beautiful baby boy. I was 21. My husband and I were just so excited to be parents. And there’s so many other things. Like, obviously my path in motherhood was difficult, but I felt so empowered after his birth, after feeling so terrified, just almost as though I could not physically get him out of me. And everyone kept saying, like, oh, you’re pregnant. He’ll come out one way or the other. But in my head, that did not exist. And so we were done having kids. And I was like, I’m never having a baby again. I was successful. I never have to do that again. Like, checkbox, I did it. And we did not we were like, we’re not having any more kids. He is perfect. He sleeps a majority of the time that he should be sleeping. Let’s just quit while we’re ahead. And then my son was about 18 months old. I don’t know what biological thing happened in me, but I was like I woke up one morning and I looked at my husband and I was like, we need to have another baby. And he was like, are you sure? Because I remember what happened last time, and I was just a ball of nerves the entire pregnancy. And I was like, we’re going to do this differently. I’m going to go into it with a better mind frame before I’m pregnant. So I was listening to a lot of your stuff again, but this time for more of the tokophobia side of it where I was clearing that worry just about being pregnant. And at this point, we weren’t even sure how quickly we were going to start trying or what our plan was. And my husband loves kids. He was like, let’s just go ahead. And now it’s like, now, why would now be a bad time? Took a couple of deep breaths about it. I wasn’t on any birth control after my son, but I was breastfeeding. I breastfed him until actually through part of my daughter’s pregnancy. So he was still breastfeeding. And I was like, oh, I just got my period back. It’ll take a long time. I have so much time to prepare. We got pregnant the first month, and I was like, I needed more time. She was ready to join the world, and I was terrified of miscarriage. Now I have a baby to take care of and I’m still breastfeeding him. There was so much, but I definitely went into it after doing the head rash clearance and just it was like, something about your voice after having listened to it during a whole pregnancy and then in labour. And I was like, Alexia has got me. Like, I am so calm.
Alexia [00:12:07]:
Oh, my God. You get me all goosebumps.
Susie [00:12:10]:
And this was 20. Oh, man. She was born in 2019. Okay, so it was the end of 2018. I found out I was pregnant on here in the United States. It’s Black Friday, so it’s like the day after Thanksgiving, so it’s the end of November. And I was like, oh, my gosh. Okay, so I’m due in August of 2019, and my birthday is in August. So I was like, I’m going to look at this as, like, an early birthday gift. It’s going to be so different. I’m going to do this differently now. I found new care providers, so I knew that from my first pregnancy, I was with obstetricians only. And I said, this time I am going to be with midwives solely. I want as hands off, but I want to know my provider team intimately. And I found a hospital. That’s where we were living at the time. It was about a 40 to 45 minutes drive. Everyone kept trying to convince me not to do it because they’re like, that’s such a long drive. You’ve already had baby. Like, what if you have a baby on the side of the road? And I was like, no, I’m not putting that in my head. I need to focus on keeping myself as mentally healthy for this pregnancy. I’m doing things so much differently this time. And I will tell you what, that pregnancy was the most uneventful, peaceful experience of my life. I felt just total calm because I was able to kind of take in everything that you are preaching about not letting anxiety engulf you. It’s okay to seek help too, if you need it, right? So I was talking to my midwives every single appointment about what my fears were and what I was afraid of happening to me. The fact that they cared enough to sit and talk to me about my fears that had nothing to do with them. I told them I was like, I want an unmedicated birth. I want a spontaneous birth. All of these things that now I could dream about her being born. And I didn’t have that with my son. I was so terrified of his birth, and while it didn’t go perfectly, I didn’t feel traumatised. I could see some positive from his birth, but it helped me see what I didn’t want in the next one. So going from someone who was like one kid, I’m done. And now I’m so excited to have a second baby. And her pregnancy was, like I said, so uneventful. I went into labour the day before my due date. She took a while to come. We didn’t encourage her at all. It was just over 24 hours. I went into labour the day before my due date. She was born the evening of her due date. There was no worry about what was going to happen. I knew that my care team had my best interest, but they were never rushing me. They weren’t like, oh, you’ve been here for X amount of hours. And at that point, my water wasn’t ruptured. So they offered me, like, I think I was 5 CM dilated. And they were like, do you want to go home? Are you just stressed out here? It was almost like them saying that relieved whatever internal stress I wouldn’t let go of. So I put my headphones in. I’m listening to calming music, all of the things I had set in place to make me feel safe. And I transitioned so quickly. Within 30 minutes, I went through transition. And she was born like 2 hours after that first transition contraction, and it was a blur to me. It felt like ten minutes, no epidural. They had offered me gas, but I said no. I just wanted to feel I didn’t get to feel all those things. And when I tell you I looked at that woman, the nurse was sitting next to me, and I was like, I never have to do that again. I felt so calm. And they laid her up on my chest. And I had done all of these things to mentally prepare for her. And it was mostly thanks to you because between I did some hypnobirthing as well, I didn’t take a full class, but I was following a lot of the tracks. It’s like breathing. And you talk a lot about being able to have resources on hand, but you were one of them. It didn’t matter what episode. It was almost just like your voice became this calming entity for me. So I would put in, like, one of your podcasts. I’m like, okay, mom was done. And then she came out and I was like, wow, I never have to do that again. I’m done. We knew that we really didn’t want any more than two children, but she hit about a year old, and I was still breastfeeding her. I breastfed her until she was, like 16 months, which was less time than my son. I think my son breastfed close to two. He was like 21 months, something like that. But I was pregnant with my daughter, and I needed myself back while I was pregnant with my daughter because I wanted to feel calm. I looked at my husband after she was a year old, and I was like, I think I want to consider surrogacy. I think I feel a drive to be pregnant because her experience like her birth was so cathartic. It was very healing. Obviously, it didn’t take away the pain and the anxiety and the stress from my son’s birth and pregnancy, but it definitely provided some sort of reassurance that I was capable. It was like, all right, if that’s really what, you know, once I became a mom, I knew, I was like, if someone else can’t experience this, I want to be able to provide that to them. Surrogacy is different all over the world. So surrogacy in the UK is different from surrogacy in the United States. It is uncompensated in the United Kingdom. And so in the United States, you can be compensated for the pregnancy and the time that you’re spending pregnant. And that’s like a whole other can of worms. But when I went into this, I was like, I want to help a family grow. I was scared, but because I had a positive birth experience after a panic birth, no peace. And then a very peaceful experience being pregnant and then being able to enjoy all the movement. And I wasn’t afraid of going to the midwife, I wasn’t afraid of the doctor. I wasn’t afraid of them telling me that there was something wrong with my baby or me. And I was like, okay, I think I can do it. Maybe I’ll just try. If I don’t like it, if I get into it and I meet these people and I decide that this isn’t for me, I can change my mind. Before I’m pregnant, I had no worries. It was almost like it being someone else’s. Genetics helped me feel less afraid. It was like I knew my body was capable. Like I had given birth twice at this point. I did it. I jumped out first and I actually gave birth for two dads. So it’s a gay couple that lives in Belgium and they have a beautiful little boy now. His pregnancy was beautiful. I did the same thing. I had mostly mainly midwife care, but I was at a practice at that point because we moved that had obese on staff, so they were able to consult and I think that gave the dads a lot of peace too. One of them was a doctor, so he was very scientifically minded about everything. It was a good compromise. And the team that I was with, they have the lowest c section rate in Florida, which is where I live, if not like the southeast region of the United States. And I was like that because that was one of my fears. It’s like having a c section. I’m like, I hate feeling numb. And my epidural with my son didn’t work fully. I was like, I don’t want to be numb, so they’re going to have to put me to sleep for me to have this baby. If I ever need a c section, just all those things that could go wrong were going through my head with all pregnancies. But I took a headstrong approach when it came to being pregnant with someone else’s baby. I didn’t think I was going to have two kids of my own, let alone now. I’m on my fourth pregnancy, or hopefully will be my fourth live birth. My life has changed completely. I didn’t know tokophobia was a thing. I really didn’t even think I had it until I had experienced loss. But I was so terrified. I want to be able to tell everyone else that’s currently going through all of those fears. There is another side to that. You can get past it. Like right now I’m ten weeks pregnant. It’s for a heterosexual couple that lives in a different state in the United States and they’ve tried to get pregnant. They’re on their own for like twelve years. So this is their first ever positive pregnancy. And they have fears. And so I’m able to kind of help them walk through their fear. And even though they’re not doing the carrying themselves, there’s a lot of trauma and loss. For the most part that comes with surrogacy. No one chooses surrogacy as their first path to parenthood. And so they have to give up a lot of those fears and worries to be able to even allow someone else to carry their child. So I feel incredibly honoured. But that’s my story. Sorry it was long.
Alexia [00:21:51]:
No, I know. It’s an amazing story. I’m just totally in awe and I just can’t believe what a journey that’s been from somebody that’s terrified to now having babies for others. Part of me is like, how does that thought drop into your head? Like, oh yeah, let’s just start having babies for the people. I just find that mind blowing and incredible. And what a leap. Generosity. I don’t know. There’s so many. Do you know where that came from? Is that were you thinking about for ages? I mean, that’s quite a leap, isn’t it?
Susie [00:22:25]:
I think part of it was. I knew that being a parent again, having a third child felt like not in my ball field, but I knew that pregnancy felt really empowering with my second. So I was like, what if I can capture that feeling without having to bring another baby home? And so at first it was kind of just like a passing thought where I was like, honey, talking to my husband, what do you think? Is this crazy? Am I just like, losing my mind? And he was like, let’s do research about it. And obviously we did extensive research onto the legal side. What were the emotional ramifications and what was the whole process? And there is a lot of guidelines in the United States that know you have to have healthy pregnancies and births prior to being even eligible to become a surrogate. At least in the United States. There’s the American Society of Reproductive now, they give very detailed guidelines of who can be a surrogate, what are the qualifications, what kind of complications in a previous pregnancy would exclude you from being able to be a surrogate? So even for me, I was like, I might not even qualify, so let’s just see what happens. And if I qualify, if the universe allows this to happen, I’m going to embrace it. I did. And everything fell into place that I said, okay, everything’s working out. And then there’s a hurdle of, will I even get pregnant? So it uses IVF. I had a lot of anxiety going into having to give myself shots daily. There’s a lot of head trash clearance that had to go on with that, too, because I’m like, I don’t like getting shots that other people give me. How can I give myself an injection every single day for like twelve weeks? It was a little terrifying, I think, the idea that I had to do all of these things. But I’m like I’m super powerful. I was empowered. I left my second pregnancy feeling more positive than negative about birth and pregnancy. So I just decided that I was ready and I did it. And I had a baby and I gave birth to him unmedicated. He came shockingly on his due date. I’ve had two due date babies.
Alexia [00:24:51]:
Oh my God.
Susie [00:24:52]:
The second one. So my surrogate that I had, he was born on his due date, but he was only like 22 minutes into his due date, so we could have had a 39 week and six day birth, but he held out for 22 minutes after midnight to come on his due date. We’ll see if I can do it a third time.
Alexia [00:25:10]:
Amazing. So let’s talk about the head trash clearance pieces. So for those that don’t know, head trash clearance is the method that I developed to get him rid of fear. So you mentioned that you’ve used it a little bit throughout all of your pregnancy experiences. So talk me through the first time that you decided to try it out and what you were using it for.
Susie [00:25:27]:
Well, I didn’t feel like an expert the first time. The first time was my son. And so I was like, yeah, I’m on your website, I’m listening to your podcast. I’m trying to go through you had some free resources, and I’m trying to go through everything as much as I could because I was paranoid that I just wasn’t capable of doing all of these things. And you kind of touch on basically putting yourself and I think you talked about categorising what my fears were like, really talking about what the fears were. Not just like, oh, I’m anxious, but being very specific about what my anxiety was for and being able to focus on those things and control talk about what I could control for some of those things. But I felt like confused, really, in the beginning because I didn’t know how to use what you were preaching, like how to implement it into myself. And so just listening to you repeat those things, talk about what I could do to not control, I feel like that’s not really the right word, but what I could do to impact my situation, I guess because you don’t have control, you have to release some of that. Like, what am I capable of doing right now to help my fear? And my fear was and I would have to name them. So my fear was being induced. And then that happened, and I was like, all right, I have an arsenal of things to calm. And whether that was like listening to calming music or even just expressing those fears to my husband, because I kept a lot of it bottled up, but if you just keep it all in, it doesn’t go away. It just sits there and it festers and it grows. And I was like, I need this to go away. But I was afraid to talk about it with my friends, who at that point, really a lot of my friends weren’t having children. And so I couldn’t really express my anxiety out loud. So I did take to the internet as well. One other thing that I did that was really helpful was I started an Instagram that was separate from my own Instagram. And I kind of used this as part of my head trash clearance, like an outlet was to be able to share the anxiety. And there’s a whole community on Instagram of women out there who are terrified or whether that be like trying to conceive or you’re pregnant and now you’re fearful of that pregnancy. They’re everywhere and they’re from all over the world. And I met lifelong friends on Instagram now and it changed my whole view of what pregnancy can be like. When I take away what is happening in here, there’s a lot of things that happen that you don’t want to feel judged for feeling these things too. And that was like my biggest fear was that if I started talking about it that people were going to tell me, like, oh, you’re being ungrateful. Then this was like a whole other aspect to my anxiety was I should be so happy that I’m pregnant and there’s women out there who would give anything in the world to be pregnant. All of those feelings had to be sorted through in order to have a peaceful pregnancy and birth. And to be quite honest, my first one wasn’t peaceful. Some people say like, oh, once you feel them move, you’ll start to feel differently. And I didn’t, I didn’t feel that way. So it took a lot of really going through compartmentalising what my fears were and talking about them and not letting them just sit and fester. Another thing was like physical release. And I’m not sure if you really talk about that, but I would see a chiropractor and massage therapist to help the muscle tension that I was developing during the pregnancy. That helped a little bit too, obviously. I don’t know if that was the thing that really helped, but I feel like it was a part of my healing process. It was like I feel like my anxiety manifested a lot in muscle tension and. I felt so achy in my first pregnancy and then being able to have some emotional clearance with my second pregnancy, I felt healthier, almost. Yeah.
Alexia [00:29:58]:
There’s a lot of tension in the body. The fear. It’s tightness. It’s very heavy.
Susie [00:30:02]:
Yes. And I think that it made my first labour longer. I mean, it was an induction, so I obviously have to say I was a first time mom. Being induced, the odds that it wasn’t going to be an immediate thing was very high. I do feel like the more peace that I had in subsequent pregnancies and births, I had faster labours. I had labours that I felt more in control of and not control in the sense of, like, I get to decide what happens, but that I knew that whatever happened, I had done everything in my power to be prepared for all of the possible outcomes and not be fearful of those outcomes. Because if I was meant to have a C section to give birth to my children, then that’s it. That’s how it’s supposed to be. But I was going to set myself up for feeling peace and calm. I had never had surgery other than like I had oral surgery when I was a teenager, but terrified of surgery. You obviously have to overcome that fear of I might have to have surgery to have a baby. That’s a huge commitment. You don’t just wake up the next morning feeling fine. And after my surrogacy, I ended up needing my gallbladder be removed when I was, like, five weeks postpartum. So while I didn’t have a C section to give birth to him, I did end up having to have surgery after he was born. Even that was difficult, and that didn’t even touch what a C section goes through. So I was grateful for that. My experience didn’t include a C section, but I was mentally prepared for in my head what the scariest possible outcome could be. And I don’t know how I would have ever done it without having your voice in my head all the time, whether that be about anxiety. And I listen to a lot of the podcasts where you are interviewing other people, particularly, I think there was one that I listened to that you were speaking to a researcher, and she was, like, talking about her pregnancy. And I really like that one because I was like, okay, so even researchers who are literally into psychology can still be scared. I feel better. I feel much better.
Alexia [00:32:18]:
The emotions, we’re all human. Even though I work with this stuff all the time and I use head trash prints myself all the time, it doesn’t stop those human emotions rolling in. It doesn’t kind of make us immune. And yeah, that story with her is just brilliant because she intellectually knows about all this stuff and yet the human part bit that the woman still feels all that to focus your mind on. Because that’s another thing, I think when you’re going through pregnancy, release birth, is to give your mind something to focus on so that you can keep focused on not what’s going on in your body. Potentially. Really good distraction, isn’t it? Just to give a kind of a mental focus.
Susie [00:32:58]:
Music really helped, definitely while I was in active labour and music without words, I found was the best thing for me. So just like instrumental, acoustic, even like manipulated music, like anything that didn’t really sound like real instruments, but it was something about just having tunes and I could kind of tune out. I could focus on the music and tune out the sounds of the hospital room. I’ve always given birth in a hospital despite having midwives. It’s very clinical. Obviously, you’re in a hospital and you feel like you’re sick. That was not peaceful. But I was able to really put into myself about focusing on what I could control. And that was like, the way I was breathing, working through each contraction, because I feel like that’s a whole other hurdle into birth, is like, well, I’m scared of pain. I don’t think the pain was the scariest part of birth for me. It was almost just like the outcome that could happen. Obviously I want my child to be healthy, but I want to feel like I was safe. And I think knowing that I was in the right place, I had the right support person. My husband has been in all of my births. He’s a professional birth partner now. After this many births, I think to him it’s like second nature. He’s just like, do you want me to push on your hips? And I’m like, he would know that I need things before I can even vocalise them. And he’s like, Why don’t you roll over? You look stressed out. And I found that I also don’t like to give birth laying down. I much prefer to do it in a reclined throne position that was much more empowering as well, because now I wasn’t on my back, and I felt like I had, I could focus on what could I control, and I could control the way I was sitting. And I know it’s not the same way for most, or not for a lot of people in the United States, at least, you don’t get to. I mean, there’s some doctors who will say, like, I don’t allow all my patients to give birth in any other position than laying down, which feel like is just a control thing, because at this point, I’ve had two of my three births sitting upright in a hospital bed. Like, they took off the end of the bed, and I gave birth sitting up. And I felt like I was able to be more present as well when it came to what position I was in. And some people really enjoy on all fours. I don’t like that. That felt like a very vulnerable position to me. So I did not like, I tried to do it when I was ready to push and I was like, no, I don’t like that because it made me feel vulnerable. And I don’t want to feel vulnerable while I’m already naked.
Alexia [00:35:45]:
Didn’t you? You were like a queen on your throne.
Susie [00:35:48]:
That’s exactly how it felt. I had a little bit of privacy even though I was completely naked. That was how it felt. More private. And another thing, and I forgot to mention this in my first birth, another thing that really helped me feel focus on the outcome for birth was having a mirror to watch him come out. I thought it would scare me because they offered it to me and I was like, I think I do want to see it. I think I need to know that I’m making progress. I was able to focus on seeing him come out. That was amazing that they offered me the mirror. And every single birth since then, I have had a mirror. And I have felt like that has made a huge difference too, because I’m like, instead of them coaching me and saying like, well, you’re doing so great, he’s almost there. I can see their head and their hair and I’m able to reach down and touch them and feel like thinking.
Alexia [00:36:44]:
About birth, like reliving obviously you’re reliving your birth now. And they are just so powerful, these experiences. They just bring it all back and obviously, I don’t know. Do you get to talk about your birth much?
Susie [00:36:55]:
Is this because maybe I don’t really talk about it a lot. I feel like I advocate for my friends who might be afraid and I’ve shared my birth experience with some of my closest friends. Yes, sharing it is very helpful. It feels helpful to me to talk about the things that scared me and reliving some of the hardest parts of it sometimes doesn’t feel good. I really do feel like being able to share the positivity. And that’s why when most people are like, my gosh, you’re a surrogate, number one, I hear, oh, I’ve never met somebody who’s been a surrogate. It’s a little wild, a little wild to me because there’s like, I think somewhere between 1500 to 3000 surrogates give birth every year. And so it’s not a huge number, but it’s significant enough.
Alexia [00:37:52]:
Is that just in the US?
Susie [00:37:54]:
It might be globally, but I feel like maybe it’s 1500 in the United States and maybe another 1500 elsewhere. I could be wrong on that. Don’t quote me. But I do know that it’s a very small number in the grand scheme of all the people who give birth every year, there’s a lot that goes into there’s a uniqueness obviously you’re giving birth and it’s not your baby, so there’s hurdles to overcome with that. But being able to talk about my birth experience with my surrogate baby, that was the most empowering thing I’ve ever done. I got to hold him. They put him up on my chest, and that was something that me and the intended parents agreed upon before his birth, that they wanted to lead cord Clamping so he stayed on me. That was very healing, because it was like I got to kind of see the work that I had done and get to tell him how proud of him that I was. Because I also feel like talking to the baby. Even my own children. I talked to all of them as soon as they came out. I told my son. I was like, Hi, I’m your mom. And then when my daughter, I looked at her and I was like, you did it. And then I immediately said, I’d never have to do that again. Jokes on me, I continue to do it. And I do have a feeling that this is going to be my last pregnancy, and not in a bad way.
Alexia [00:39:24]:
I don’t believe you.
Susie [00:39:27]:
My husband’s supposed to. He’s like, maybe you don’t say any definite, you don’t know. Maybe I’m ready to move on from being in the pregnancy and birth part of my life, the fact that I’ve been able to do it. And number one, I’m grateful that I survived because there are people who do not survive pregnancy. And that was a huge fear. Even though it could have been irrational, it was still very, very real in my head. With my first pregnancy, I had no reason to believe that I wouldn’t. But somehow it was something to overcome. And I do feel like all of my births so far have taught me something. Each one has taught me something different. And number one, I know that I love giving birth without medication, being able to feel all of the feelings. And I felt more in tune with my body. And some people are like, you’re crazy. I would never give birth without an epidural. And I feel like that’s such a personal choice. And I’m so grateful that I’m able to find teams, multiple teams of people who are willing to help me have the birth that I can envision, because being able to envision a birth felt impossible years ago. And I’m finally at a place I can look forward to birth. I’m almost, like, eager to do it again. And I never thought that would be a fact of my life. Obviously, there’s fears. There’s still fears. I think even now, as a person who’s given birth three times, I still have fears coming up. And I’m ten weeks pregnant, so I’ve got 30 more weeks, give or take. I have to make all 30 weeks and then I still have to get through the birth and anything happened, but I’m not going to let my fears control the outcome for me. I can focus on what I can do and what I can control. I’m actually giving birth with the same group that I gave birth to my daughter with. We moved back to where we were. So I’m hopeful that I’ll have a very similar experience to her birth. They let me eat during my pregnancy. That was, like, huge. I didn’t get that my first birth or not pregnancy birth. My first with my son, I was induced. They refused food, and basically I just had sips of water. And then with my daughter, they encouraged me to eat. So I think that that helped too. I was able to fuel myself to get through 24 hours of labour with her. Granted, transition was very fast. The funniest part about my third birth is that when I think I was like I think they checked my cervix and I was like, 6 CM. They’re like, oh, you’re doing great. I walked in labour. So they were kind of like, oh, this is their third time. This will be an easy one. And I went and I went into the room, and they checked and they were like, okay, you’re about 6 went. And I sat on the toilet, and I found that the toilet is my favourite place to labour. I looked at you got to call the nurse right now. Can I have this baby on the toilet? Nurse comes in. She’s like, you were just 6 CM. There’s no way. She was like, we need to go get the midwife. This happened really quickly. His transition was so much faster, but it was a lot more peaceful. But there’s different feelings that come with astrogacy as well, because you’re having to think about the parents. And I head the parents in the room with me. I wanted them to be able to experience everything. With me, it’s their child’s birth, just as if it would be my husband’s birth as much as it was mine. And so having then I was thinking about, like, am I being too noisy? Am I scaring them with like they were both men, so they’ve never I don’t think other than the doctor, he had gone through some OB rounds when he was in medical school. He was like, I’ve never just sat in on a birth. So this is a little intimidating. One of the most amazing parts of it was having everyone be able to experience it, and they were scared. There was, I think, a few moments where I think they could have used some anxiety reducing it was just beautiful and amazing.
Alexia [00:43:54]:
Your husband in that as well?
Susie [00:43:56]:
Yes. My husband was like, I’ll just stand back here. I don’t really like to be touched. I found that out. Don’t really like people to touch me. I want to feel control of the situation. And it’s not comforting to have people, like, touching my arms or my legs. And so my husband knows now he’s like, I just leave her alone. I talk to her. And then if she wants me to help her, I will offer my help because during my daughter’s birth, he tried to be really like, oh, I’ll rub your shoulders. And I was on the I think it’s called the cub. It’s like a birth stool almost, but it’s inflatable. I did not like that. Everyone was like, raving. They’re like, this thing’s amazing, this birth stool. I did not feel comfortable. And I leaned over and I touched my husband’s knees to kind of be into the contractions. And I was like, oh, your legs are so hairy. I just don’t want to be near you anymore. And my husband felt so bad. It was a fact of life. It was like I was going through something and I was figuring out in the moment, like, what made me comfortable and what didn’t. And I was not apologetic about any of the things. I was like, I don’t like that, being able to control all these things and say, like, nope, I don’t like that. Yes, I like that. And no one argued with me, but if they did, there was a couple of times when a nurse would less at me about taking my gown off because I don’t like to labour in clothes. I navigated all of these things, but having my support person so my husband was there also advocating for the things that I wanted and that I didn’t want. They kept saying, like, oh, you need to put some clothes on. You need to put a gown on or something. I’m like, no, if you don’t want to see me, feel free to leave the room. He would advocate for me, too. He was like, no, she’s more comfortable in a different position, or she would rather be sitting on the birth ball than on the know. And they’re like, we need to check your cervix. And I do feel like this is a very United States thing. We need to do this. And I’m like, do you need to or do you want to? So I do very minimal cervical checks because I realise they’re painful and I don’t enjoy them and they don’t tell me anything. I learned that I could trust my physical instincts. I never thought that I would feel this way about birth or pregnancy in and of itself. Pregnancy can be really hard. No one really talks about the hard stuff because they want it to look like it’s this beautiful, magical thing. And then those of us who don’t feel the beautiful, magical thing the whole time are like, am I doing it wrong or am I not? That’s just not the case.
Alexia [00:46:52]:
I think it goes without saying. I’m going to ask you anyway, what have you learned about yourself? I imagine that you’ve learned a lot about yourself going through all of this.
Susie [00:47:00]:
I am way stronger at advocating for what makes me feel good. And I feel like it makes me a better advocate for other people too, for my children. And I think my husband is a better advocate for other people too, because now he’s kind of found his voice in pushing back against the typical behaviours surrounding pregnancy and birth. But he also has, I think, unique insight to helping someone go through the fears that come with being pregnant. And I think he secretly had some fears too, that he was afraid to talk about. With our first, he felt kind of indifferent about the whole thing, but then he was more vocal with my daughter’s pregnancy and he was like, we’re doing this together. And I know not everyone has a supportive partner like this. And so I don’t want this to make it seem like this was the only way I did it, but having somebody, anybody, whether that was like my husband or my sister or my mom or a best friend or whoever. Just having someone to share the fears with and not feeling like you are completely isolated in this bubble of shame or sadness for feeling not joy. Because it allowed me to feel more joy. Because I could share those things and say I’m terrified. I don’t see this going in some beautiful sunshine enveloped way. And so sharing my fears with somebody else and then him being able to share some of his fears back, I think we learned a lot about each other. I think that’s helpful. But I’m not afraid to speak up anymore. I didn’t want to cause a ruckus or hurt anybody’s feelings, but I’m like, this is my birth. This is my child’s birth. And then obviously with surrogacy, this is my birth, but this is someone else’s birth too. And I want to make this an experience that is positive for all of us. And I don’t know, I just look forward to giving birth again. I didn’t think that was possible.
Alexia [00:49:21]:
You are a total badass. I have to say. You’ve kind of found your voice. You’ve found your power. You’re clear on what you want, and you will stand up for yourself and ask for it without coming across some faulty bitch like some people like, oh, my God, she’s just so whatever language people might have about women that are being assertive and asking for what they want. You’ve got such a gentle way with you, but I can imagine that you’re like you don’t take any crap, and you’re like and you get what you want. Is that fair to say?
Susie [00:49:51]:
Yeah. I feel like being in the moment, like all of the emotions and the adrenaline because I totally believe that adrenaline plays a huge part in birth. For me, as soon as it kicks in, I’m not afraid to say, I’m taking all my clothes off. I’m sorry if someone else is uncomfortable, but I’m going to do what’s going to make me feel the most comfortable right now, and that’s to be naked. And for some people, it’s going to be completely clothed and they’re going to wear a whole gown, maybe like a bra. And during my surrogacy birth, I did wear a bra just for comfortability. For me, I was surrogate by a bunch of men in labour. So not that any of them cared, and obviously they were looking at my vagina. So I feel like it’s all about mitigating, whatever makes you feel comfortable. And for me, I love having a mirror. I want to be naked, I want to labour in whatever position I want, and I want to give birth sitting upright. Those are my very few and far between things, and no one’s going to take them away from me. But without learning that I head control and let even if someone pushes back, at the end of the day, I can do what makes me feel safe. And making myself feel safe has always been my top priority. And I don’t think anyone would argue with me anymore about giving birth. I feel like as a first time mom, a lot of people are afraid to be assertive because they don’t want to make waves. And the one thing I wish that I would have known in my first birth, and I don’t know if it’s like a rite of passage where you just have to learn that you can advocate for yourself. But I felt like they wanted to check my cervix all the time, and it was so painful, and I just let them kept doing it. And I learned better. I learned that I could say no or not right now, or just ask them, Why? What are you going to get out of it? And I never knew that I had that power. Definitely empowering myself to speak up was one way that I helped further labours and births. No one can tell me that I’m not going to do something to be comfortable in birth anymore.
Alexia [00:52:07]:
Has that expanded to other aspects of your life? You’ve found this power now, and I imagine yeah. Okay, so tell me, how is this showing up elsewhere?
Susie [00:52:16]:
I mean, I deal with anxiety on a regular basis, like with other stuff, because I have two kids and I’m trying to raise them to be nice people, like good human beings. How do you teach your three and a half year old to advocate for herself? I’ll tell you what, we’ve done a pretty good job because we have this one thing that we talk about in our house a lot is like, I’m the boss of my body. We try to empower our kids that we don’t make fun or we don’t talk about other people’s bodies, the way that they look or the way that they act. That’s not kind. My son and my daughter both experienced bullying already. And there was a situation where my son, he’s a bigger boy, like, my husband is six foot one. I don’t know what that translates. I think it was like 71 CM something, I don’t know.
Alexia [00:53:05]:
Six foot one, that’s good for me. Yeah, that’s tall.
Susie [00:53:08]:
He’s a very tall man. And I’m a foot shorter than my husband. So our children are my daughter is very petite and little, and our son is a bulkier kid, but he’s been made fun of and he’s an empath all the way. Like our first child came out. He feels everything. He’s so emotionally in tune with himself. If he sees someone being sad, he’s sad with them. And my daughter’s not that way. She’s definitely not empathetic, but she is just sharp. Someone said something to her about her clothes, like, oh, I feel like your shirt is dirty. And she looked and she’s like, I’m having fun and I’m the boss of my body, so if I want to wear a dirty shirt, I’m going to wear what? But now we are kind of regretting not regretting, but sometimes it gets us because we’ll say, hey, it’s time to go take a bath. You’re a little dirty. And she’s like, the boss of my body, I don’t have to go do that. And I’m like, well, you don’t have to. I would recommend that you go take a bath because you’re kind of dirty. And she always agrees. But I do feel like we are more empowering to our kids and teaching them that no one is allowed to speak to them. Sometimes they call us out even. They’re like, mom, my son will say, mom, you’re being kind of rude. And I sometimes have to take a step back and I’m like, Am I bossing him around? There’s a difference between telling your child something to keep them safe or telling them something that’s in their best interest or telling your child to do something because you want it done and you want it done right now. There’s like, a very fine line of teaching independence and empowering them to speak up and be vocal about what’s important to them versus do you want a child who’s going to question your authority? But I totally believe that I want my kids to grow up to question authority figures because not everyone is in charge of you.
Alexia [00:55:13]:
Well, Susie, I feel like we could talk all day. You’ve got so much experience, just so much to share, and it’s just been wonderful to hear this journey that you’ve made from fearful possibly tokophobia to now just I still think it’s a bit mind blowing, I have to be honest.
Susie [00:55:29]:
But just incredible.
Alexia [00:55:30]:
Just incredible. If there’s anybody that wants to you’ve mentioned an Instagram account. Can people come in? Are you still running that Instagram?
Susie [00:55:37]:
Yeah, I still use that Instagram account. I’m not as active. I use it to follow other people now on their journey. But I do post about my surrogate here and there. It’s Dear so Dear Baby underscore h. And it was originally when I was going through Dear Baby Hamilton to my child, but now it’s kind of moved on to know all sorts of anxiety over trying to conceive and could a miscarriage happen and all those things. And I shared it with some of my close friends recently and they were like, oh my gosh, you documented everything from every pregnancy test to all of it. And I’m like, yeah, I had nowhere else to share those things. The community is huge on Instagram trying to conceive. Now it kind of moved into surrogacy for me. So I know that Instagram can be a little triggering to some people because I’m actively talking about pregnancy a lot. But it’s just one of those things that I used it to be an anonymous release. I didn’t share my face for the first six months or something on there. And it wasn’t until we had a positive pregnancy and blood work was showing that he was growing that I shared my face because I just wanted it to be this anonymous sharing ground. And it really was. It was amazing.
Alexia [00:57:03]:
Just to summarise then, in terms of what really helped you throughout your pregnancy, then just to recap, it sounds like you did some hypnobirthing. Obviously, there’s some podcast listening going in there. You did some head trash clearance, you went to the Physio. Was it physio? The osteopath, was it? Yeah.
Susie [00:57:18]:
So I did like chiropractic care and massage and I feel like that was very helpful.
Alexia [00:57:23]:
Is there anything else that you did that was really helpful for you, though?
Susie [00:57:27]:
Really? I feel like the biggest thing was being able to talk about finding one person, even if they never talk back to you, if they never give you any feedback, but being able to share it and know that it’s going to a safe place. So whether that be online or to a friend or a family member or your spouse or your co parent, whoever it is, being able to talk about it and just let that information release and not feel an obligation for them to provide you safety or guidance back, they can just soak it in for you. And I don’t think that someone should take on all of your anxiety and stress, but being able to freely share and say, I’m scared of this, whether that be what the next doctor’s appointment is going to hold, are they going to find something on an ultrasound, am I going to have to have an epidural? Like, am I going to be induced, am I all those things? I shared all of those things with Instagram community and I shared them with my husband and I was able to. It was almost like letting them out felt good. So I do recommend finding someone or something as an outlet, even if you’re completely anonymous. I didn’t feel alone anymore because I was able to keep letting those things out and not just having them stuck up here alone like festering in my own thoughts. Oh, that’s wonderful.
Alexia [00:58:56]:
Thank you so much Susie, for sharing your story. It’s just been wonderful to listen.
Alexia supports families planning pregnancy and birth. She helps them to overcome their fears and feel calm and confident about birth and pregnancy.
Alexia also trains birth professionals in the Fearless Birthing, a unique approach to birth preparation that is ideal for those who have fears around birth.
- Erin’s Tokophobia Healing Journey - 6th March 2024
- How Unhealed Tokophobia Can Affect You In Unexpected Ways - 27th February 2024
- Overcoming Birth Trauma: Heather’s Journey to Positive Birth - 14th December 2023
